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"If I Talk About Sex It Causes A Fight" [Mailbag]

"If I Talk About Sex It Causes A Fight" [Mailbag]

This blog post is dedicated to easing the pain of discussing sex with your woman. Nancy Wasson,  Patti, Taylor, Karen Brody and Carlos Xuma, four of my trusted advisors, give their answers to two similar Revive Her Drive customer’s questions.

“We don’t talk about sex at all or it causes a fight as she says that’s the only thing I want and she feels it is the least important part of the relationship and I feel it is a very important part of the relationship.” – John

“I don’t think there is love between a man and woman any more. All men want is sex.” Then she told me that all I do is talk and want sex. I have worked so hard not to talk sex because a slight mention of sex, and she is upset. It is true I have talked about sex, but I have put myself on limits. Yet, she recalls far distant times and makes them as fresh as if I said them yesterday.

I have vowed to avoid sex altogether, to avoid kissing, holding hands, hugs or saying “I love you” or commenting on her beauty. She tells me those things revolve around my needs. She seems to hate it all. I think to her, this is my keeping sex in focus.

To handle my biology, I sometimes have a private session of personal care. If she comes in on me, she will join me and take over. I don’t get it! I just wish I could redirect my mind off of sex and not get so torn up emotionally.

 

 

 

I know this is a bit complicated, but any advice would be cherished.” – Kenneth

First reply from Nancy Wasson:

That is a difficult question Kenneth asked. Let me share some thoughts with you from my perspective.

One thought that came up for me was triggered by the sentence: “Last night, I longed for the same encounter.” I’ve found that we increase our chances of disappointment when we want one encounter to be the same as a former one—whatever the situation is. It’s helpful to approach each encounter with what in Zen Buddhism is called the “beginner’s mind,” which means not to have any set expectation but to view each situation through “fresh eyes.” It can be a real set-up for disappointment to try to re-create a previous experience.

Another thought is that now he and his partner are really polarized about sex—it’s all very serious and heavy and tense. He’s not going to be able to proceed forward but will need to take some steps backwards to work on the basic relationship and adding lightness and a sense of humor and playfulness into it. His partner has expressed that she thinks all he wants from her is sex, and she is programmed to resist. When this happens, laughter and fun and a sense of play disappear. The relationship and sex become much too serious.

When his mate walks in as he’s “handling his biology” and “takes over,” that’s a perfect time to smile, laugh, and joke together afterwards—as well as for him to compliment her, such as saying, “You’re the best wife, honey” or “I cherish you.”

One important principle is “what you resist, persists.” You want to start where the other person is and build on that in small steps—but first you have to be okay with where they are. Otherwise, there will be a tug-of-war going on. The mate has to feel totally loved and accepted for who she is and where she is. That’s the starting place.

And when they do have sex, I’d advocate adding laughter and playfulness, which can add to the bonding and enjoyment. In her comments, the mate is communicating that she feels “less than” with her self-esteem—that all he wants is sex, and she feels devalued as a person, even though she doesn’t put it in those words. On one hand, he has a right to want a passionate sex life—on the other hand, until she feels totally valued and loved deeply in the way that communicates love to her (reading “The Five Love Languages” could be helpful here), she won’t be motivated to want to extend herself sexually to him.

And I have to ask, “What is happening after the sexual action is over?” Are they snuggling, is he saying sweet, romantic things to her, is he deepening the emotional intimacy at this crucial time? That alone can motivate the other person, whose sexual needs may not be as strong, to enjoy the experience because of the emotional intimacy and soul-connection.

So there’s not an easy answer to this question, but one of the main points I want to make is that sometimes you have to retreat to be able to advance. Actually, I really like the quote by Douglas McArthur: “We’re not retreating; we’re advancing in another direction.”

Warmly,

Nancy Wasson, Ph.D.
KeepYourMarriage.com
ControllingSpouse.com

Nancy Wasson has been an LPC (Licensed Professional Counselor) for over 20 years and is a Marriage Coach and co-author of Keep Your Marriage: What to Do When Your Spouse Says “I don’t love you anymore!”

From Dr. Patricia Taylor

Kenneth may be attempting to “mindread”. Men are taught that mindreading is a great seduction strategy so I can understand why he’d think of trying this. However, it’s lead to some brick walls. Ouch!

While his intentions are good, he is having (at best) random success. That makes total sense because mindreading – even with sincere intentions of trying to figure someone else out – really does lead to hit or miss outcomes.

Yes. Mindreading can backfire – and even lead to (yikes!) counterproductive ends. Frustrated, confused, and lonely, to name a just a few.

Can we cut to the chase, then? Mindreading really is often not much more than an exercise in speculation. You’ll win some rounds with this approach, and lose some, too. Hopefully not too much damage is done and the wins outnumber the losses by a long shot.

So, is there a way to improve on mindreading? After all, he does want to know what his beloved wants.

For starters, our guy needs to connect with his partner and have some intimate, vulnerable communication. Find out what is going on with her.

In addition, he can gather additional information via the biofeedback loops one gets naturally in making small offers. See where she “bites” and chows down.  Tentatively? Pleasantly?   Best is when she says yes, enthusiastically, on what “bite-sized” menu items he offers. In this fashion, our guy can lead her step by step into greater degrees of mutual pleasure.

She seems to enjoy him sexually when the mood is there so I am not imagining this is a *not* a sex problem per se. But, we’re kind of flying blind until that communication and menu-running has run for a bit.

Over time, with this type of attention, his lady will feel his super high-quality attention and start to bask in it. Just like flower open in the sun, so will women, given the caring and opportunities to come out and play in their own way.

Of course, if there are deeper issues, then they will have to be addressed.

Almost anything can be changed if both these partners are willing, able, and eager. I see lots of room for growth and expansion in this situation.

Vulnerability and Small Offers are two of our four keys to Seduction. By mastering these keys, he will letting her know that he is serious about her pleasure. And he is bound to have a great time too!

Dr. Patti is the creator of Expand Her Orgasm Tonight and The Seduction Trilogy: Seduce Her Tonight, Seduction Accelerator and Her Sexual Trainer. http://expandedlovemaking.com

From Karen Brody:

Dear Kenneth: First of all you’ve got to stop looking for that magic formula to get sex!

Focusing on how you succeeded last time is a waste of time; it’s like trying to see a bird land in the same place twice. When you try to recreate the same wonderful moment you had after 10 p.m. once, you rob that special moment of it’s magic.

You say your wife says that telling her she’s beautiful or that you love her is a turn off for her. I find that hard to believe. Perhaps she doesn’t enjoy holding your hand of kissing you because it feels like a strategy to lure her into bed. If it’s a strategy, she’ll feel it.

Until you learn how to experience these moments of affection as pure and satisfying in and of themselves she will resist you – as they all have a hidden motivation.

Your wife comes to play with you when you’re engaged in self-pleasure because it’s a rare moment that you’re turned on, and that turn on isn’t focused on her. I suggest you take care of yourself more often, so you are less needy and eager, and so you can approach her with the desire to connect with her, rather than to release.

When your wife says “You only want sex,’ what she’s saying is she’s not sure it’s her you want. In other words, as long as you achieve a climax you’re happy.

If she doesn’t feel that you love her, and, desire her equally, she will never trust your sexual motivations. Tell her each day that you love her, and that it’s because you love her that you want her. This will likely make a very big difference in how she relates to you sexually.

Karen Brody helps men have the highly satisfying sexual relationships they want with women. She is an expert in sexual dynamics and male empowerment. Get in touch for a consultation. http://www.loveandintimacycoach.com

From Carlos Xuma:

He’s gotta get back to being the man a woman WANTS again, rather than the one who’s wheedling his way between his wife’s legs every night. Or playing games to get what should be mutually desirable sex.
His vowing off sex is a reflexive reaction to avoid pain, but will ultimately give him more pain when he realizes he was just playing head games with himself.

My first suggestion is that they seek some form of couples counseling.

Their situation needs a guiding force and mediator to help them not only get what each wants, but help each person see through their own pain to have compassion and feeling for the other person’s.

In short, there is a lot to this situation that is not being communicated, but should be worked through with an experienced couples therapist. I’m all for self-healing, but there is much more here that is bubbling beneath the surface of his description.

Carlos Xuma, Alpha Masculinity http://www.carlosxuma.com/alphamale/

With love,
Susan Bratton

21 Comments

  1. RE; “if i talk about sex it causes a fight” This piece has four authors 3 of which I had no problem understanding however Dr Patti has also written a piece that I can only regard as the biggest piece of dribble i have seen written most of us APES are not that high on the evolutionary ladder Do you think Dr Patti could come down to our apeman level and write in a language that does not require a university degree or a translator to desipher Im sure there would be many more people out there who have the same problem understanding the high faluting words that she uses please ask her to write in common folk language or if she is incapable of same could you add something that will translate what she is trying to get accross

  2. Wow! His dilema is simillar to mine except we were not married.
    Each author provides a reasonable solution, and wished I read this earlier. From reading the above authors maybe rekindling the romance and her catching him only reinforces her belief.

    What I am doing is focussing on rebuilding the attraction in small steps.

    Good luck

  3. From the perspective of a woman who has been married for many years and been through many ups and downs in our sex life, John needs to reconnect with is wife first. Once he does that and finds out what she wants, then they can find a way to move forward together. Most women want to be *heard* and want to be *loved*! If she feels safe, loved, and heard, she will be open to sex. I would also venture to say that most women want to be wooed into the bedroom. In other words, start early in the day not 15 minutes before bedtime. When my husband starts suggesting sex early in the day, it helps me get in the mood and plan for it at the end of the day. I need to feel needed and wanted. He can accomplish that by hugging me, kissing me, telling me I look sexy, telling me how much he wants me, etc. But he needs to start early in the day and work up to sex. He can do things like relieving some of my responsibilities during the day to make it easier for me to cut off the to-do list in my head. When my husband comes home with something to cook for dinner and offers to help me prepare dinner, it relieves stress for me and helps me feel warm towards him and makes me feel appreciated and valued. This helps put me in the mood. Once the kids are in the bed and we are alone, he shouldn’t expect to skip right to intercourse no matter how long he’s been working up to it during the day. Women need time to warm up emotionally and physically. It’s important for him to do things to get me going physically. I don’t just see him and suddenly get prepared for sex. That’s just not how a woman’s body works even if we wish it did. I need him to do things to get me turned on and ready for intercourse. It takes a good 30 minutes of foreplay for me to feel ready for more. A quickie is nice once in a while, but it’s not really my thing and I have found it’s not for most women. Men tend to rush things. I appreciate it when my husband takes his time and gets me really ready. Once you start doing that, she will start to crave more, trust me, she will start wanting it more if you spend the time to make her feel appreciated and cherished. Tell her she’s beautiful when she’s spread eagle on the bed, looking at you with desire. Tell her how much it turns you on when she’s wet for you. Make the room comfortable for her too. She will reward you for all the little things! Good luck!

    • Very similar at our house. She will go for an afternoon quickie but we usually take plenty of time. Foot massages seem to have a direct line to her clitoris. She is an athlete who seems to feel each individual muscle (I don’t have that kind of body sense). I’ve come to love working on her back and when she is so grateful, I let her know that I get as much pleasure as she does. Now, to why I started this, She regularly lets me know that when she’s not aroused or a quickie is on the menu, that she loves to help me to de-pressurize, even then. I love that she does and that she that she tells me. Bottom line, tell him that you are happy to do it just for him sometimes. The actual telling is so sweet…….and erotic. Say it and watch him smile. (and those back rubs include cupping that wonderful butt, and working on gluteals and deep inner thigh muscles, oh my). I feel like Spencer Tracy in that wonderful old movie, working on Katherine Hepburn. I think I’ll tell her that.

      • P.S. This was a reply to Starflower’s post.

  4. John,

    “I don’t think there is love between a man and woman any more. All men want is sex.” What you have to remember is that everything that comes out of a woman’s mouth is a test. She’s subconsciously testing you to see if you act like the man she should have basically, by telling you these things.

    “All you do is talk and want sex.” What have you done to her to have her thinking like this? If you’ve had sex with her and not cuddled her afterwards, maybe that’s why she’s thinking you’re only sleeping with her to climax. It’s hard to reverse now that she’s hatching this belief, but the next time you get her to bed, remember to make love to her even after sex to assure her she’s the one you love, not climaxing.

    Of course, you have to last long enough and learn and experiment with techniques that will cause her to climax, too. If you don’t, she’ll eventually dump you for sure.

    Sex and romance are two different things. You seem to have a lot of work ahead of yourself in this, so I suggest you buy one or two romantic novels and read those. Those will help you tremendously in seeing what kind of SENSUAL moments women yearn for. You don’t even have to touch her to soften her up. It’s likely your woman doesn’t even want to be seduced, she just wants romance in her life.

    P.S. Even when Seducing a woman, it’s not essential to talk about sex. It works a lot better when you just do it, just like in Susan’s Stelth Seduction tips.

    – AJ

  5. In reading this post, and re-reading it, I keep coming back to what the woman is going through, and perhaps it is not even about sex, but rather her difficulty in being able to love herself, which, of course, needs to be there before she can adequately love others, including her husband. We are seeing only the surface issues, when, in fact, there are most likely deeper issues on both sides. Sending love and prayers to both of them.

  6. For crying out loud, get that man a copy of Revive Her Drive.
    It will show him exactly how to reconnect. Small favors at first.
    Touch for Rapture. Four elements of seduction. By all means be dominant, lead her. It is all about romance, and it doesn’t necessarily mean it has to lead to sex.

    • Exactly, Tom! I totally agree . . . has he read the book?

  7. It sounds like she is not getting any big Os out of his

  8. Dude, from the time we enter puberty until we are mature enough to accept responsibility for loving our wives, we suffer under the delusion that we can talk women into having sex. All we need is the right pick up line, right? Unless you’ve discovered how to give a woman verbal orgasms you need to change your approach. First get off your knees, she’s never going to respond to your begging. Second if you don’t have the Revive Her Drive and Seduction Trilogy already get them and use them. Third you have absolute pearls of wisdom advice from real experts here, read their advice and take action. Fourth, you need to have a serious conversation with your wife about what she needs. Why you say? Because you’re both starving and unless one of you takes responsibility for feeding the other, you’re going to starve yourselves into divorce. You’re the man so it’s on you to feed your wife first. Once she’s fed she WILL feed you, but she won’t act first that your job! (Sorry Dude that’s the harsh reality of being a man, we lead women follow). So you need to find out what she needs! Does she need you to help out around the house? Or to talk heart to heart about your feelings? Does she need a date night, compliments love notes, gifts? You need to find out and fill her needs so she’s not starving. Only then will she be open to filling your sexual needs. That’s what Dr Patti means by making small offers and getting a string of yeses. I’ve never bought any online program where the people were as sincerely helpful as at Personal Life Media so don’t be afraid to ask and have some confidence things will work out if you decide to take control and direct your wife to a turned on life

  9. Carlos has it right. Women that are happy and emotionally healthy who are with a happy and emotionally healthy man that they choose to be with are thrilled when their man takes the lead and gives her incredible experiences and sexual pleasure and in doing so, is satisfying and celebrating his own masculinity by creating this experience with his woman. If this is not happening, then there is something else going on in the dynamic in one or both Partners that is blocking the natural human tendency towards love, pleasure, and play, and this is where the counseling can be helpful. Unfortunately, one or both Partners may be resistant, clinging to their pain (or the anger which masks it), rather than being honest with themselves about what it is they really want and need in a relationship and deciding together if they are each willing and able to reach a compromise on these needs and then do the work to make it happen. The best and only thing each person can do is ensure they are as happy and healthy in themselves as they can be, with strong self love, self esteem, and discharge any emotional poison heaped upon them by others, along with beliefs and judgement they never asked for. Your Partner may or may not do the same. Give them time. Give them support. Give them real love (meaning for its own sake, not to get something in return) and see what happens. It might take a couple of days, weeks, or even years if you choose to keep going that long. Or it may never happen. But you will never know if you don’t do your own work and give your Partner that chance.

    Best to you,
    A

    • A woman never will admit the truth. In a marriage, man and woman are one. There is always forgiveness, even if one does not ask for it (forgiveness). It is the responsibility of each partner to forgive and forget. Modern times and through BS advice the husband and wife are now treating each other as individuals. Both are responsible.

  10. Just like a puppy, what to do when you catch the car! go back to basics, make her chase you again make her invest in you and she will fight harder to keep you, make sex a mystery and she will always want to know the answer and be involved, do all this without words if she questions it or talks about sex just smile and kiss her and she will start to chase. good body language and true emotional smiles will get them all the time ,be the man.
    Hug her be firm then gentle, kiss her be firm then gentle, then leave with a smile but no words, for words are cheap

    good luck

    Cossie

  11. Wow, I wish my wife would finish when I am masturbating. She keeps reminding me that I did just after she left the bed unsatisfied as was I. She was fuming. We haven’t made love since 2/14/13. She said I was too cut and dried. “Want to make love or in our code, want an appointment? Never seduced her. She used to say, want to take a bath? At least it was disguised. I feel that some relationships go on a bell curve. Little by little building the passion and slowly fades away. All of the recommendations are excellent. I read on this site, to ask a laundry list(baths, rubs, massages etc.) leading up to the act. I found through therapy, that I have problems with sex and looking for sex therapist so I feel for this guy. How many women write to complain the the man they are with has no interest. Maybe that is why so many sites are up with affairs to offer. There were 1000 cases of STD in my area last year and it is not that large. What a dilemma!!!

  12. Okay folks, i get all the men lead, women follow. I get that u find out her needs…give menus/string small offers etc…men do all the leading and all the while not needing etc. Okay , but what about grey area. Wife married many years…shes shut down etc but she refuses to reveal what she values most even when u just flat out ask her. How do you overcome that? What do you do if she refuses to allow herself to be revived? I say jump ship and revive someone else…what do you think???

    • My sentiments exactly, A relationship is mutual, everything else she says is BS and just an excuse to hide behind. I say “jump the ship”, but be careful, you may be “jumping from the frying pan into fire”. Get out of the relationship and allow yourself one to two years (to heal), before you start any relationship with another. But definitely not with your ex. The shit will never end.

  13. This very similar to my marriage of seven years. When I want sex, we would fight and argue. Most nights I would sleep in frustration and a lot of time have short period of not speaking to each other.

    The relationship in a Marriage not just the man’s. It is mutual and the responsibility is also the woman’s just as much as the man’s. The rubbish modernisation is introducing together with human rights and gender is BS. The only time things can go wrong is through sickness which may be psychological in which a counsellor or medical doctor could diagnose.

    However, my question is your partner working?

    If she is then you may have a bigger problem? She may be in touch with someone else and would prefer his company to yours when it comes to sex. I walked out on my relationship last year and I have fully recovered now and looking forward to starting another relationship soon.

    Whatever counsellors and advise you will receive,will never end your problem even if gives you a temporary relief. I know my woman has all ready tasted another man and she will never stop that relationship at her work place because they see each other every day. According to my experience it will never end, even if she may say she has changed. That is BS, because of work they see each other everyday and during the course of work they will always rekindle their feelings and desire for themselves. The song by Bellamy Brothers “daytime friends and night-time lovers says it all.

    Maybe she gives herself into intimacy with you when she finds you “handling your biology”. It could be out of pure guilt and obligation that she gives it to you. But the problem seems to continue. The next time she screams at you. It is basically love-less.

    If she is not working then maybe she has found someone else she socialises with when you are at work. When you mention sex to her she maybe reacting out of guilt.

    You will find that if this problem persists, it may affect your manhood as well. You may already be experiencing this As you grow older the problem will become worse and may turn to “performance anxiety” which may even lead to you loosing it altogether. Your health and personal enjoyment is just as important.

    Counselling will not help if a “Love triangle” exists.

    If there is no third party then I would suggest you try rekindling that desire in her as suggested by the others above.

  14. I think Princess needs a wake up call. I can’t stand the “it’s all about her BS”. She is using her Vag to control you and the relationship is most likely over. Throw her out. If she comes back and wants to listen to you and your needs then take her back if not move on. Dear MEN, stop apologizing for being a man. It’s not all about her, your are deserving and an equal partner in the relationship. If she can’t meet you half way then it’s over. Run!

    • Wow Andrew.. You are a brave man.. I cannot, sorry am not so brave

  15. My wife has been taught that sex ends at 45. What? Men as they age seem to learn more about sexual needs of a woman through experience. I can relate with this experience of the blogger that sex is a gift and sould felt as a gift. Turning down a relationship offer is a kick in the shin. Discussion would be the first reply to this dilemma. Second would be to understand her changing needs and respond to them and this discussion should include your own changing needs.Last but not least, relationship values need to be negotiated. Sometimes the expectations of one might not be the expectations of another.

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